What open source toolkit does fatwire compare to and are there some particular advantages to fatwire?
How hard is fatwire to export out of and move to a free alternative?
How stable is it as a platform to write java extensions on?
From a development persepective, FatWire can be unfriendly. Having worked on a number of sites using this application it can easy bloat, and become difficult to maintain.
From a user perspective there has been alot of effort in the UI and this has led to a highly functional tool.
From a client perspective all clients bar 1 (a large news agency) were happy with the end result. FatWire can slow when using complex logic to generate menus or breadcumbs for example or when you have a large amount of content. This is the main reason the one client was unhappy. The FatWire site regularily struggled under the load. It sometimes seen as a solution to all web needs.
As such FatWire succeeds in serving Static Content & Semi Dynamic content, but can flounder when forced to do fully dynamic sites (from my experience).
From the original press release:
FatWire Software announced the rollout
of FirstSite, which is a set of tools
and best practices that helps
companies using FatWire Content Server
get their first Web site or
application running quickly while
providing a foundation for future
expansion. FirstSite includes a
collection of standard templates and
site components that are common to
most sites, combined with
documentation, training, a rich
developer community, and best
practices methodology. FatWire and its
solution partners are using FirstSite
as the basis for developing
content-centric applications for
specific vertical markets. With only
minor, cosmetic alterations,
developers can use the code in
FirstSite to implement a first site,
while simultaneously learning how to
utilize Content Server's capabilities,
such as dynamic content delivery,
personalization, caching, and product
catalogs.
Firstsite is not a product, unless this has changed since 2004 (unfortunately I cannot look, since their developer site is down). Fatwire's Content Server does not compare to any Open Source CMS that I know. It's scope goes much further. I will answer your questions one by one:
Advantages - There are many (or nobody would buy it, and it is not cheap)
On the delivery side: scalability, fine-grained cache control, stateless servlet architecture, ....
On the back office side: virtually no limit to asset types, dynamic content attributes, find-grained security and access control, ...
On the development side: Intelligently architected API with good coding productivity, tag library, ...
Openness
You cannot easily expect to migrate content between any two CMS products, open source or not. While there are ways to extract contant from the database in XML and other forms, using product tools, or simply at the database level, I don't think that this can be an argument for or against using a particular CMS. Ever tried to migrate from Drupal to Joomla?
Stable
I worked on several Fatwire implementations from 2000 to 2004 (back then it was OpenMarket Content Server, then Divine Content Server). It was stable enough for the Washington Post, the New York Times, and the S&P sites, and I would expect stability not to be an issue today.
Fatwire is really unique concept from developer point of view. It builds everything on a very abstract, extremely flexible clever asset modeling framework which is stored in relational database.
Application logic is based on "templates" which actually are pieces of JSP code. This JSP code is not like conventional Java, but tags instead. It takes very long from a developer to learn these tags and Fatwire asset api. Expect even months before skilled develpers start to be productive.
Almost nothing useable samples ships along the product. There is advertized "FirstSite" but it is way too simple for the purpose this product is used normally (huge complex sites). So pretty much everything has to be built from scratch.
Cache control is advertized to be one powerful feature. Yes it is, but we had extremely long learning curve and it never worked exactly like one assumed.
Wysiwyg editing has been missed from this product even it is advertized. At least during 2009 it had serious conceptual problems which practically prevented using it in live environments. But it was cool feature for demos and marketing of course. Today it might be fixed.
As a summary and if I were a customer with limited budget, I'd select any open source alternative instead. Mostly because development costs with Fatwire are high due the uniqueness of the product, lack of good documentation and extremely long learing curve. Of course the product price tag is also thing to consider.
And to answer to questions: you have to start from scratch if you move from Fatwire 6.0 to any open source alternative. And it is stable to build Java extensions on.
Fatwire stores content in relation database and file system. Depending on what type of content (structured/unstructured), Fatwire can be evaluated.
Related
My team has been writing a dashboard application using Node.js, Twitter Boostrap, Mongo DB, and Mule for an ESB.
Recently an executive asked us to change our approach to a Portal/Portlet container like Liferay.
Some of us on the team have experience with Liferay, and we have pretty negative feelings about it. Dealing with things like full-page refreshes, portlet lifecycles, style and theming issues, and limited DBMS coverage are at the top of our list of complaints.
We see where our executive team is coming from. They have decided that they want to make the dashboard extensible and easy or easier to plug into for other groups.
Is there a solution out there which can balance the modern web expectations of users with the enterprise needs of IT professionals and executives concerned with building and extensible application with something like Liferay? Pluggable widgets are important here.
Node would obviously be our preference with something like Grails as a close second.
Thanks,
This question may not exactly be a good fit for StackOverflow's format, but I can offer some thoughts still.
If you want to stick your current platform, you need to figure exactly what features your executives want to get out of moving to a new platform. Are those features something you can build into your current platform? How much effort will that take compared to rewriting everything else? How effort will it take to learn a new skillset across your whole team? I'm sure your team can learn the new skills effectively but that still takes effort and there will be growing pains as your teams learns. If you can show to your executives that you can get the same features for a similar or less effort and that you can still have similar total cost of ownership, you can make a case to stay on your current platform.
Also I think you are underestimating what a Portlet container can do. I work mostly with WebSphere Portal so maybe thats why I think most of the pain points you mentioned really aren't that difficult to manage for me. Just because your container needs a particular DBMS to manage itself does not mean you can't use a separate DB for your custom data needs. JSR-286 introduced serveResource as a way to make AJAX easier to implement in portlets. In WebSphere Portal (don't know about Liferay), changing out the whole page content without a page reload might the most difficult on your list I'll admit though.
Modern doesn't have to mean bleeding-edge tech. And the large software products can still perform if you know how to use them right, just like any other tool.
I have been planning to build a Dentist Application for the use of the Dentist to add patients(with medical profiles...), organize visits, manage balance/fees....etc
I know Java, .NET( C#) (some windows forms), and Python. Do you have any suggestions with the language I should maybe start with and the framework and IDE that will make my life easier (and help me finish in a good amount of time). This program will be connected with a database of at least 1000 patients...
IDE's I am familiar with : eclipse, Netbeans, and Visual Studio.
I want suggestions with reason explanations (why would you favor C# over Java ....compatibility....etc)
Thanks,
It's not the database side, or even the programming environment, that will be the issue for a dental practice.
I consult for a dentist friend of mine, and the opportunity arose to sell him a fully-functional contact/document management application to run his patient database.
In the end, I couldn't in good conscience recommend my own application, because not being designed for the dental sector, it lacks the specialised interfaces with dental imaging systems.
Databases, appointments, invoices, etc, are easy.
But what a dentist needs is something that integrates with the dental records themselves - the X-ray images of teeth. It needs a simple UI, easily usable by the dental nurse while she works with the dentist while he has his hands in the patient's mouth.
We could have written a suitable graphical interface to an image library (imagine a diagrammatic representation of the teeth in their relative positions in the mouth, linked to the images themselves), but it wasn't worth it - especially as there are several highly specialised dental packages around already.
I suggest to start with some research on the subject (the dentist domain) and to make a decent functional design before you start to think about IDE's and languages.
And then try to figure out some other things:
For instance, will you make a SAAS or a windows client, do all your customers have internet access. Iis the sensitive patient data allowed to be stored on the web.
I believe that question is very relative to the person programming. I think as the developer you have to figure out where you would be most successful at or what you want to get out of the project. If you are using this project to make money then do what you are comfortable with. If you are using it to better yourself as a developer then pick a language you are less confident in.
The one thing I want to add, is remember PHI (Protected Health Information). So, you have to have patient privacy in mind when building an app like this.
If it were me... I would write something in .NET and use Visual Studio which works very well for windows forms. Windows forms would work very well in an office environment.
Just my 2 cents.
First introduce yourself to the business knowledge. Healthcare programs aren't written overnight and you have to take into account that you need to have a very secure application and probably also need to keep years of information (the program I was involved in in 2001-2002 had to keep 30 years of patient history due to Belgian law).
Choosing the technology is actually entirely up to you: what are you good at? Can you find already prebuild pieces of code or controls ...
You can write such an application in any of the languages you have mentioned.
Research the features you will need and the support you can expect from each language and the different available libraries.
You need to come up with a good design first (regardless of language/platform), and make sure you have all the requirements - how many people should be supported in the system, how many concurrent users, privacy of data, security features, access patterns etc...
You should probably use the language you are most comfortable with, in particular if the features you require have similar support in the different languages/frameworks.
I'm currently looking at developing an application, and have a choice between doing a standard ASP.NET web application or integrating it into SharePoint. Our client would like it to be SharePoint if possible, as they are under pressure to put all new development into it, but standard ASP.NET is still an option.
It is an application to manage and view data in a database with about 10 tables, including an approval workflow when certain new items are added. Referential integrity of the data is important.
I have experience of developing ASP.NET applications, but very little with SharePoint. Does anyone have any criteria they would apply to deciding between the two?
So far I am thinking along the lines of:
Referential integrity of the data is important and SP doesn't seem to handle this very well without writing lots of custom code
SharePoint doesn't seem very scaleable with the suggested limit of 2000 items in a list
The application has an approval workflow, which does seem to be something SP does well
On the wholem, it seems like we would end up writing lots of custom code and not really using any of the out of the box SP features. So my thinking is why not just write a standard ASP.NET application.
Are there any other key things we should consider?
By now, you may have already found this link: http://blogs.msdn.com/sanjaynarang/archive/2009/06/19/should-i-build-my-application-in-sharepoint-vs-asp-net.aspx. If not, it's a decent starting place with some good questions to ask.
What follows is my take as a long-time .NET developer (for as long as the platform has been around) and a SharePoint architect (since 2003). That's basically my way of saying that I've been on both sides of the fence.
In my opinion, SharePoint is a platform, not a product. As ASP.NET provides valuable web-based services to the core .NET framework, SharePoint supplies additional services and capabilities on top of ASP.NET. The platform removes the need for writing common code pieces that are a part of so many ASP.NET apps: security code, user profile management, personalization, UI/UX baseline, etc. When you get into the plumbing, you get even more: rich caching support that requires minimal configuration, customization modularity via Features, and more.
Should every application be built in SharePoint? I'd never push for that. With my current client, we use a mix of SharePoint-based and custom ASP.NET applications. Whether an application gets built in SharePoint vs. written from the ground-up in ASP.NET is a function of what we're doing. We conduct the same sort of exercise you are. If SharePoint's features and functionality can be brought to bear to reduce development time, it goes in SharePoint. If the need is too specific or we feel we'd be working around SharePoint, we go the custom app route.
You have some very specific concerns for your application, so let me take a crack at them with the little I understand about your requirements:
REFERENTIAL INTEGRITY: based on what you're saying, it sounds like your data model is pretty specific. Building your information architecture to natively leverage site columns, content types, and lists probably doesn't make sense. That doesn't throw SharePoint out, though. There's absolutely no reason why you couldn't build the data model you want (presumably in SQL Server) and then consume it with components that reside in SharePoint. If you're using MOSS, some of the BDC WebParts might work for you straightaway. If not, you'd still be writing controls and/or pages to work with the data, correct? There's nothing wrong with using SharePoint as your presentation layer for access to SQL directly or (in a more scalable, n-tier fashion) go against business services somewhere else.
2000 ITEM LIMIT: this is a common concern and one that is misunderstood. There is no 2000 list item limit; the actual measurement is 2000 items per view (and that's with out of the box views, by the way) or "container" (such as a folder). You can store many more times that (millions, if you like) in a list if you partition with folders, build your own view to page, etc. Again, given your data structure and the likely need you have to dodge SharePoint's lists, this wouldn't be an issue if you simply consumed data from SQL Server.
WORKFLOW: SharePoint is nice as a workflow host, and the OOTB workflows are handy. I'm assuming you're looking at MOSS (versus straight WSS), but just in case: the approval workflow comes with MOSS. If you're constrained to WSS, you only have one workflow available to you: the three-state workflow.
At the end of the day, SharePoint is .NET and built on top of ASP.NET. Much of the code you'd have to write in a SharePoint app you'd need to write in a custom .NET anyway. I'd look at things from the perspective of understanding whether the experience and features SharePoint affords you (as a developer) can help speed your development cycle and/or improve the user experience (something we, as developers, sometimes forget).
David in Dakota does have an excellent point, though, in that the dev experience for SharePoint is different from straight ASP.NET. The need (or rather, best practice) to deploy via Features, understand specific SharePoint concerns (e.g., lifetime and disposal of SharePoint objects), etc., mean that there will be ramp-up time if you do build in SharePoint. There are quite a few good resources out there (including folks here on StackOverflow) that can help, but you'll need to factor some learning into the equation of whether or not SharePoint makes sense.
One more parting thought: Microsoft is slowly shifting many of its own products and platforms to leverage SharePoint as their UI/UX layer, and the trend is picking up some steam. PerformancePoint, Project Server, Team Foundation Server, and Commerce Server all use SharePoint as their presentation tier. The trend will probably continue, though I don't know how far. If you use any of these products (or their on your technology roadmap), a SharePoint investment now might pay off later.
Despite all of my writing about and advocating for SharePoint, I don't think it's the right tool in every scenario. I still build WinForms apps, smart clients, command line apps, and more quite a bit. It just comes down to weighing "what I get" for "what I spend" (in both time and money).
I hope this helps!
Your evaluation is quite accurate. (It would help to have more detail about every feature your application needs but that's not really practical for this medium.)
The problems you mention have been largely solved but you would need to understand and implement the solutions. For example, there is a CodePlex project that can assist with referential integrity and there are recommendations on how to manage the number of items in a list. But using SharePoint is never going to give you the freedom of writing an ASP.NET application from scratch.
Another thing to consider is how you and/or the client expect the application will evolve in the future. If it will need more collaboration-style features or features such as version history on list items and integration with the Office client then SharePoint may be the better option.
You should also think about the complexity of deploying and updating your application on SharePoint.
Our organization started on the SharePoint path about two years ago. Before that, we (the developers) wrote mostly asp.net front ends for SQL back ends. Now it seems like every time a new project comes up, we are asked to “make” it fit in SharePoint; and we have stuffed some things into SharePoint that probably should have been stand alone applications or web applications due to complexity and interactions with other technologies.
My question is: Where do you draw the line as to developing a project in SharePoint versus Web/Winform application, and how do you convince your manager(s) that SharePoint may not be the best solution for a particular project?
I sort of agree with you that this is sometimes a tough question. In general, though, I agree with the cliche that you just have to think about a sharepoint app a little differently. If your data can be considered as list-based, then SharePoint probably isn't a necessarily bad development framework. It may seem like more work on the surface, but IMO the challenges just move from one place to another. If you use things like custom field templates and web parts, you can relatively naturally handle all sorts of data. And you get the positive aspects of SharePoint for free (an already mature security framework, built-in searching, site and list templates/definitions, personalized page customizations, yada, yada).
I also I don't know what you mean by "complexity and interactions with other technologies" here, so it's hard to imagine what specific issues might be introduced when SharePoint is added to the mix.
If your dev team is relatively inexperienced with SharePoint and you care about quality and deadlines, I can definitely see your point. It's not an easy learning curve, but I think the SharePoint product is more naturally extensible than many people give it credit for.
There is, in some cases, a third option between a SharePoint application and an ASP.NET application. You can build custom site and application pages and deploy them to a SharePoint site. (The book Inside Windows SharePoint Services 3.0 gives a good overview of how to do this.) This will allow you to use ASP.Net and SQL Server within a SharePoint environment (which means you can also take advantage of things like SharePoint security). It's not as easy as developing a plain ASP.Net application, but it's a compromise.
Of course, this is sort of a technicality if they're wanting these new applications to be built on SharePoint technologies (lists, libraries, workflow, etc.), not just to be "inside" SharePoint.
One of the primary reasons why you might put an applicaiton in SP is when you want to take advantage of the building blocks SP gives you:
Security (share security with the site)
Data (store some or all of your data in lists)
Provisioning (if you want you app on multiple sites)
Some basic data UI e.g. Lists give you that and you dont need to build it.
One thing to consider when trying to 'integrate' a new app into the existing pool is whether there is any overlap in data (customers, inventory, etc) that would benefit from the merger.
There is also the benefit of being able to back up multiple applications and all of their respective data in one place.
Why are they asking for it all to go into SharePoint?
In my experience it is because the 'ole SharePoint intranet is being great as a portal to keep everything together and findable under the one information architecture.
Approach the issue from a uses perception of the application space in the organisation.
So long as the application looks and feels just like part of the intranet site and the user does not have to think about how to get to it (and how to get back out), you can pretty much take any architecture decisions necessary to get the best bang for the organisations buck when it comes to implementation and maintainence.
When we started thinking about the site less from SharePoint vs other stuff to the nice woolly concepts of Information Architecture, findability and usability, our decisions not to make it actually inside SharePoint, but still skin it like the Intranet became easier to sell.
I am currently working on a project which requires migration of content from different content management Systems to SharePoint. Are there any good, preferably open source, tools that would help me do this? Also, what are the best practices that I would have to keep in mind when it comes to such projects. One more thing that i would like to factor here is reusablity, because we might have to work on similar migration projects, from other Content Management systems in future.
You can check http://www.codeplex.com/SPMigration (open source, project started by a Microsoft consultant).
This framework gives you an importer tool, as well as some exporter example (FileSystem for example). You'll problably have to code your own exporter.
This MSDN blog also goes into some detail about the Migration API and may be useful as its generally very had to do this sort of thing without getting your hands dirty
http://blogs.msdn.com/sharepointdeveloperdocs/archive/2007/11/30/content-migration-in-sharepoint.aspx
Also, IMHO you shouldn't dismiss proprietary products as although they can be expensive they may save you considerable time and therefore cost if you have a large conversion project.
http://www.tzunami.com/Pages/default.aspx
http://www.avepoint.com/products/sharepoint-migration
Tricks and tips -
http://www.parallelspace.net/portals/ALS305-mwherman-Content%20Migration-1-1-18-RC6_FINAL.ppt
We have had good mileage from going to the nearest university and grabbing some IT students to do a manual migration.
The students like the extra cash and it is sometimes easier when the Information Architectures of the site changes between systems.